Exclusive: Steve Pougnet Talks Personal Toll, Part II

Steve Pougnet Gets Personal in Part II of Exclusive Interview

PALM SPRINGS — After not speaking for more than a decade about the so-called corruption scandal that rocked City Hall, turns out that former Mayor Steve Pougnet had a great deal to say. There is no anger or rage in his voice, just a subdued tone that he let so many people down.

There were moments during the one-hour interview in which it was nearly unbearable to proceed. The regret he feels is sincere and palpable. The familiar laugh was absent. But we carried on.

Uken Report (UR): Think about this for a minute. What one word would you use to describe what you did? Would it be stupid? Dishonest? Arrogant? Something else?

(Pause)

Steve Pougnet: Stupid is a good term. It’s just one word. Stupid’s probably the best.

UR: And you’re so smart.

Steve Pougnet: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, really good record except for that moment that I said yes to him. Yes, that is correct. And I will live with that forever.

UR: Steve, there were a lot of people hurt by what you did. Who do you think you hurt the most and why?

Steve Pougnet: Well, I think I hurt supporters of mine. I mean, people that believed in me, in my leadership of the city who trusted me. I mean, you don’t get in two mayoral elections 70% twice without a lot of trust built up. And I earned that trust through lots of good decisions and lots of good things that we did. And then I failed them by doing what I did. And I feel horrible about that because politicians, especially in today’s day and age, there’s so much distrust between certain political sides. And you know me; I never played one political side against the other.

I never did that. When I was elected in 2003, I remember Jim Stewart, a big Republican in town, he was all antsy with three gay members on the City Council. And he called me up or something and I said, “Why don’t we go have coffee, Jim?” And we had coffee for two hours and then ended up becoming incredibly good friends. Unfortunately, he passed away from COVID. So, I disappointed a lot of people on both sides of the aisle by that action. And I’m sorry for that, and I regret that. And there’ll be a shame that goes with that for the rest of my life.

UR: Did your actions take a toll on your marriage?

Steve Pougnet:
Well, certainly. Did it increase the stress? 100%. But I’m also blessed to have an incredible spouse, (Christopher Green) and whose very, very, very understanding. And so, there’s one thing that we always said we would do during the whole process. Of course, we never thought it would be 10 years, but we always said, if we don’t communicate our thoughts and our feelings on what’s going on during this process, it won’t be good. So, the one thing that we made sure we did, we just had an open line of communication. Every time I came back from Indio or a couple of times I had to come back from Riverside. We talked about everything. And we’ve been together over 33 years now. Our relationship and marriage is terrific because he’s been a terrific person.

UR; I’m so happy, Steve. I’m truly happy. What did you tell your children over the years? If I’ve done my math correctly, they were elementary school children when this story broke.

Steve Pougnet:
Third grade, they were in third grade.

UR:
Oh my, God. And now they’re young adults.

Steve Pougnet:
Now they’re 19. So, during the course of it, because it was so sporadic with the kids, we didn’t, while they were younger, talk to them as much about it just because of their age and nothing was happening. I mean, to be quite honest with you, nothing was happening. So, it really was the last couple of years when Malcolm said, “I really think we’re going to get to trial.” So, it was interesting because I did chat with them before making the decision to take a plea. I mean, I think I told you once there was an offer, I flew back to Denver to meet with my family, especially with my kids, to keep them 100% informed. It’s the only way I’m not going to go down the road of 10 years from now, they find out Daddy got in trouble. They already know stuff, but you got to tell them everything, just to get their viewpoint on it. And they were great. Julia … had been following it for years, right?

And so, we talked to her about it. She was very up on everything that was going on, asking me questions. And of course, boys work differently than girls. Beckham was like, “Well, it’s been so long I thought maybe things had just kind of gone away.” I said, “No, they haven’t gone away.” And they were great. And they said, “Dad, let’s just get this over with us. Let’s move on. And if there’s any risk of maybe going to a trial and being found guilty and going to jail, we don’t want you to go to jail. They said, take it dad.” And being a felon means that there’s certain countries, Cindy, that can be very hard for me to go to, traveling out of this country. And you think about it, my kids will probably, a lot of kids today study overseas for junior year or semester or something. I might not be able to see them. But both kids were just very, very supportive. They’re mature, good kids, and they’re fully involved. I mean, I didn’t hide anything from them. Nothing.

UR: So, am I to understand that you taking the plea agreement was a family decision?

Steve Pougnet: Yes. Oh, yeah. Yeah, 100%. Yep. We all four had agreed on that. Yep.

UR: That is so cool, Steve, I wish I could meet your children. I was going to ask this later, but I’m going to ask now. Steve, and this is very personal, but you said you’d answer anything. During the 10 years did you seek counseling or therapy?

Steve Pougnet:
I did not. Nope.

UR:
I’m sorry, what was the first part?

Steve Pougnet:
No, I did not.

UR: Okay. So. what will you do now?

Steve Pougnet:
Well, once the summer is over, the kids go back to college, which they go back in August. I volunteer and I’m still a good fundraiser. It will be very hard to find a job. But as I said, I’m not 52, I’m 62. That’s it. Yeah. So, I will do some networking again up here and volunteer. The more you get to know people, the more you can share your story of what happened. They’ll see that I’m not a horrible guy and made a mistake and new opportunities will arise, right? And it could be a paying job, or it could be more volunteer activities. But I’m not the type of guy to sit in a house and hide for my last 20 to 30 years in my life. That’s not me. So, the more people we get to know up here, I’ll get involved.

The one thing that I did, I didn’t do therapy or counseling, but I mean my health-ness. I focused on my health those 10 years. And that was really important to me. I still run every day. I ran every single day. I was in Palm Springs for all those different trips where I had to be there and things were continued. I’d go run up to the Palm Springs Aerial Tramway. I’d go running my old haunts and see some of the same people who were riding bikes, Laurie Allison. I would see her in the mornings over the years. I’m out for my runs and she’s on her bike. The things that kept me balanced, I guess, or well-balanced is definitely my running. I went back to the swim center in Palm Springs, that Olympic pool. I’ve swum all over the world really. And there’s nothing quite like swimming in that pool. It’s like magic, right? And so those are the things that kept me going.

UR:
Interesting. You make it sound so almost romantic.

Steve Pougnet:
I’m telling you, that pool, which I started going to in 1996, it is a… anyone who goes to that pool with the mountains behind it, it’s like a magical place. I’m telling you. I love that pool, the Palm Springs pool. There’s nothing like it. I don’t know if romantic’s the right word, but it could be close. It’s soothing.

UR: Soothing?

Steve Pougnet:
Yeah. It’s just, it clears your mind. I mean, obviously there’s not a day in 10 years that you don’t think about this. You just do. Whether it’s what’s happening, what’s going to happen next. The latest bill that’s come from the attorney, I mean, because never ever, you don’t ever stop thinking about it while it was happening. So, the running cleared my head and swimming in the swim center, especially this last month, has cleared my head and it keeps me focused.

UR: That’s terrific, Steve. I’m glad to hear that. As part of your agreement, as I understand it, you must pay back the $325,000.

Steve Pougnet:
Yep.

UR: Some media reports say you will pay the restitution from your monthly pension. Is that true?

Steve Pougnet:
I’m not paying it out of my pension. I will pay it off over time from my income sources.

UR: How long will it take you to pay that back? Do you know?

Steve Pougnet:
Well, Cindy, I would probably be paying the rest of my life.

UR: That’s what I wondered.

Steve Pougnet:
Yeah. I mean, for these 10 years I’ve had Malcolm as attorney. It has taken every single thing I have. But anything that I had in savings, anything that I had saved up, I scraped. Because I can tell you my attorney bills were far more than $325,000. So, I’m not left with a lot, but I’ll manage. I’ll be paying this off for probably forever.

UR Do you think you would ever move back to Palm Springs?

Steve Pougnet:
We will definitely find once the kids are out of college where we want to land, but Michigan is not where you want to be in the winter. So, would Palm Springs be one of the spots that we would think about for January, February, March and April? Of course. I mean, we have a lot of friends there. On your earlier question about people that want me to go to jail or the people I disappoint. Yeah. But I got to tell you, there’s a ton of people that still support me and know I made a mistake. I mean, I know your nine letters submitted on my behalf. I’m not sure if you know that. Fred Noble wrote a letter on Pougnet’s behalf as did Ginny Foat, Mark Aanton,

UR: Yes.

Steve Pougnet:
Right when this started, I think the first day I went to Tommy Bahama with Shelley (Saunders) and sat outside there. Because the one thing that I always did through the years when I came into town, I always walked downtown to see how the project was going. I always did that. I was never afraid of that. But a gentleman who started a place called Townie Bagels, it’s a bagel place in Palm Springs. But he and his partner, never met them, came up to me and thanked me so much for the project that he’s expanding his business by opening another location. It’s all because Palm Springs is busy.

So, there’s those people out there too, and I’m happy about that. I mean, listen, it doesn’t take long for people to forget who the mayor was or is, whether it’s me or Ron (Oden) or Will (Kleindienst) or Lloyd Maryanov, or Sonny Bono. Sonny Bono, I’ll always remember. All of us other mayors, I mean, not like they’re gone, right? And of course, mine will be tarnished, of course. But the one thing that will be there is a booming town. I mean, the town a couple years ago was ranked as one of the top places to visit in the world. So, would I want to come back and to answer your question and still be a part of the community that’s doing so well? Of course. So, it definitely wouldn’t be off the table that I’d come back. We’d come back.

UR: That’s terrific. Steve, that is the end of my prepared questions. You were very direct, very forthright. Is there anything that you thought I might ask that I did not or that you would like to add?

Steve Pougnet:

If you were to ask me a question about what is the one thing … there’s so many things I’m happy about as mayor. But that evening when former City Councilor Rick Hutcheson, former City Councilor Ginny Foat and former City Clerk Jay Thompson and I married people, when they had that one window in 2008. It was an incredibly magical day. We never turned a marriage down in my office. I went all over the city. I went up in the hills and on trails and married people. We did it. It was great. I’d just like to say there were some people and organizations, including Equality California, who didn’t want us to do that because they considered it a mass wedding.

Equality California was the lead driver of that campaign and lost it, and they didn’t want us to do that and called us and it was like, “No, we’re going to do it.”

I’ve done a lot for the LGBTQ community in Palm Springs. Some people just don’t realize it, but we fought so hard to get our a 100% Human Rights Commission rating. When the first rating came back, when I first became mayor, it wasn’t 100% people were like, “We didn’t even know what the survey was.” We fixed it right away. We were 100% ever since. I am really proud of taking my kids — Julia and Beckham —down Palm Canyon and walking my dogs down Palm Canyon and my kids in the golf cart, and us as a family throwing things out. My son’s throwing footballs and my daughter’s throwing stuff. For years we did that. And those are, besides the economic stuff and the development stuff, to me,  But I’m just very, very proud of really leading such a diverse city and hitting new milestones from everything that we did within the gay community.

I mean, that’s something that I’ll take for the rest of my life, knowing that we improved people’s lives outside of just small businesses doing well and tourism doing well. I helped make people’s lives better. And I can do a lot of things that I did wrong with Mr. Meaney, but I did so many things right when it comes to those things. And I’m proud of that. I told the judge this when I was talking to him because he asked me some of these same questions, and I said, “I enjoyed being mayor from the first day I took the oath of office, to the last day that I was in office.” I made a terrible stupid mistake there in 2011, in September 2011, I did, but the very first thing I did when I became mayor …  we had an eighth grader come up, and I forget his name, but he asked us to consider signing the Kyoto Protocol, right? And all it was, was a document that said the city would care about water and the earth and things like that. And Ron wouldn’t do it, right? And I was like, “That’s ridiculous. As I become mayor, we’re going to sign that.” So, the first thing I ever did was sign that Protocol that night. And of course, our sustainability commission was born that night.

And that’s the first thing I did, was just to let the public know we care about other things in the city, the water quality, et cetera. And the very last thing I did was dedicate the 9/11 memorial at the fire station, which I helped raise money to fund. And that’s the very last thing I did, my very last act when they had a piece of the steel for the World Trade Center, and then we raised the rest of the money and dedicated that memorial. So from the beginning to the end, I loved that job. I coveted that job. I’m just sorry that I made that mistake in September 2011.